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SO I HAVE A CONVERSATION WITH A YOUNG ABOUT MY BLOG YESTERDAY. HE WENT ON ABOUT HE LOVED IT & I WAS PLEASED...HOWEVER, THE FOLLOWING CONVERSATION VIA YAHOO MESSENGER CAUSED ME TO BE CONCERNED...
Him: I have not every been f&ck before, but I have sucked my bro lol
Me: yr bro?
Him: Yeah he is a year older but we did it when we were 17 and 18
Me: but he is yr brother?
Him: yeah, we were just wrestling, and he started it so what it felt good.
Me: ok
Me: so is yr brother gay?
Him: No he is married now. Im the one who is
Me: uh-huh
Me: I am sure he is
Me: so u guys never talked ahimut wot took place?
Him: I’ve never discussed it with another soul
Me: o
Me: k
Him: u think it was wrong to experiment with my bro?
Me: DUH!
Me: he is yr flesh and blood
Me: if it wasn't wrong u would have told others about it
Him: I disagree cuz all we did was experiment. just played. and no seed was taking inside of either of us. besides who u closer too than a brother.
Me: so why haven't u told anyone about it?
Me: if u feel it isn't wrong
Him: cus I’m not sure being gay isn’t wrong.
Me: but u were adults (almost)
Me: that has nothing 2 do with being gay right now
Me: this is about you and your bro messing around
Him: u saying it is right to be jacked off by a stranger but not every a brother.
Me: yes I am
Him: o k why? I’m interested.
Me: dude if u don't know then I can't tell u
Me: sorry
Him: so am I doomed because of one mistake.
Me: I am not saying that
Me: just that if u can't acknowledge that it was wrong then something is wrong
Me: right?
He may not feel it's wrong, but knows it's not widely accepted. And our perception of what's wrong or right is not necessarily his.
ReplyDeleteMuch like being gay in some countries (or communities or organization or whatever). You know it's not wrong, but you don't tell a soul about it either.
Yea, if he has to ask...he knows deep down it wasn't correct.
ReplyDeleteEveryone is different. To him, it may NOT have been a big deal. He might just see this as another dick (even though it was attached to his brother). I, for one, am in no position to judge another gay man when it comes to sexual situations/mistakes that may or may not have happened.
ReplyDeleteAnd who knows, maybe he was just making up a story to get a reaction out of you. You never know on the internet.
XOXOXOXOXOXO
why would we judge? if i'd had a brother, i think i would have tried to blow him too. heck, i've been dreaming about blowing my father for the past few months. these are thoughts; and i'm honest with myself about having them.
ReplyDeleteI have no words right now. Maybe I'll have something to say tomorrow or a couple of minutes or hours from now.
ReplyDeleteTG-K you could have been a lot more sympathetic and less judgemental with the kid.
ReplyDeleteThe older generation needs to take responsibility and take on more of a big brother role to younger guys.
These things happen between brothers, and cousins et cetera. It's extremely common. And from the convo it sounds like it was just a one off thing.
They might have technically been adults but at that age they're still kids.
I guess everybody has their preferences. Someone asked me one time, "you ain't never thought about doing nothing with your brother." I was like, "hell no, that's nasty." Whatever floats your boat I guess.
ReplyDeleteGayte,
ReplyDeleteI have to agree with Ka-Os, that you should've been less judgemental and more sympathetic to the guy. Right or wrong shouldn't matter he was opening up and sharing his a private part of his life with you. He deserved the same compassion about that as we all as homosexuals want and expect when we "come out" to heterosexuals. At that moment none of us would feel good about hearing that we are sinners, are going to hell, and will be damned for all eternity because of the gender of the person we love and share a sexual intimacy.
Don't get me wrong, I don't think sex between syblings is right either, but that was their choice at that time. And atleast there's less consequences between brother than there would have been between a brother and a sister.
Personally I think you owe the guy an apology, not for your beliefs, but just the handling of the situation.
Just something to think about my friend.
wow. just wow.
ReplyDeleteAnd JNez,
ReplyDeleteBlowing your father, really? I would love to discuss with you the rationale behind that?
note2self77@gmail.com
I must agree that you were a tad bit judgemental towards his action. The same reaction you had with him, may be the same similar reaction a straight person has towards you liking another dude. And accepting an act of pleasure from a stranger that you've only known for 30 min(just an example), is no better that accepting pleasure from someone of your own blood, at least one knows where the other has been though.
ReplyDeleteAnd technically they were still kids and you should know how in those teenage years the ways of experimenting and curiosity becoming even stronger because you're starting finding out just exactly who you are as a person.
This really isn't too big of a deal. In some countries and cultures people, straight & gay or bi, get married to their cousins, or half brothers/sisters.
Umm...okay, I may have to think on this one and come back. I've never been one to pass judgment, but this one has me a little speechless.
ReplyDeleteMy brother was the first person I came out to when I was 14 and he was 18. He is still my best friend and my best defender. I'm now 30, he will be 34 soon. And yes, I'm pretty sure he took advantage of me knowing I was gay and got more than a few blow jobs out of it - and still does. I don't think he is gay at all and I'm pretty sure he's never messed with another guy. He is married, has children, and doesn't show any signs (and we all know we would recognize them) of being gay. Still, on those occassions he indicates he wants to hook up, I get hard and stay hard until we actually do.
ReplyDeletetravis
spears.park@hotmail.com
Okay now that I am able to function again after reading that, because I was on mute there for a minute. It is really strange, but I have heard stories of brothers that get down with each other, and there are all kind of excuses, the thing about this is that the brothers know it isn't right in fact it is incest, but because no children will ever come from this union they get down and move on. I spoke with a young gay guy about his encounter with his older brother and he simply stated "My brother would come into my room at night if he didn't get any pussy from his girlfirend that night and do me." I couldn't believe what I was hearing, but he introduced me to his brother and I figured out what the busness was: the brother(older one) knew that his younger brother was in the life or would soon be, the older brother has been fucking around for years and has children, both the brothers are handsome and there is no reason they couldn't get sex outside of family. Strange!
ReplyDeleteHe's not sure if it's okay to be gay but see's nothing wrong with having sex with his brother?
ReplyDeleteI have officially had my Friday Afternoon Mind-Blowing.
Um... no words
ReplyDeleteK: You're usually more sensitive. Why did you respond so harshly? Obviously, the young man touched a raw nerve. As a mental health professional, clients have divulged their deepest, darkest secrets to me. Regardless of how I personally feel about their transgressions, I must refrain from judgment at all times. Failing to do so prevents the development of a therapeutic relationship and increases the person's existing guilt, stress, and anxiety. If you get the chance to speak to the man again, try to focus on how he's doing now. If he honestly does not have a problem with his past, neither should you. I still love you, man.
ReplyDeleteAssociate Pastor Losojosnuevos
Ewwwww....
ReplyDeleteTG-K - don't feel too badly. You just made a bad judgement call on this one. I think you probably let your personal beliefs cloud your primary responsibility - to look after our own. We should always be aiming to defend, nurture and positively re-enforce our boys, 'cos no one else is going to.
ReplyDeleteI still luv ya :)
I am 17 years old, and looking back I can't even count the times I've thought about sex with a cousin of mine. [I have no brothers]
ReplyDeleteTrue I never acted on it, because I had a stronger feeling to hate those thoughts I was having. But those thoughts of sex with my family member were still there.
Though I have kissed a guy cousin of mine, tongue and all, but it was played off as an "I dare you" "eww you're gay" sort of joking thing. Many people have their own personal views on it, but I see no problem with it. Experimentation is all a part of growing up.
I agree your reaction to what he was sharing with you wasn't the best. But at the end of the day even the best role model has had at least one "WTF moment", because we are all human.
[i think i'm gonna write a post with a more thought out opinion of "brotherly love"]
TO ALL OF YOU THAT VOICED YOUR OPINION ON THIS SUBJECT PLEASE NOTE THAT THERE IS NO NEED TO TELL ME THAT YOU STILL LOVE ME BECAUSE I AM NOT THIN SKINNED. I IN FACT EXPERIMENTED WITH COUSINS AND ALIKE…HELL WHEN I WAS 12 YEARS OLD & I STUMBLED ON MY UNCLE MASTURBATING I WANTED IN ON THAT ACTION, BUT I DIDN’T. I KNEW THE BOUNDARIES @ THAT AGE BUT I FEEL THAT @ THIS GUY’S AND HIS BROTHER’S AGE THERE IS NO EXCUSE…I WOULD TURN A BLIND EYE TO THAT IF HE TOLD ME THAT THEY ARE MERE KIDS BUT WHEN WE AS ADULTS TRY TO BLUR THE LINES BETWEEN RIGHT & WRONG WE HAVE PROBLEMS…SOME THINGS IN THIS WORLD ARE RIGHT AND SOME ARE WRONG & NOT MATTER HOW MUCH RELATIVITY WE TRY TO THROW UP IN THERE THAT WON’T CHANGE. THIS HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH HOMOSEXUALITY, THAT’S THE BIGGEST PROBLEM WE FACE HERE & I AM SURPRISED @ THE COMMENTS THAT SUGGEST THAT CODDLE SOMEONE BECAUSE HE IS GAY…HOW ABOUT THIS WHAT IF HE NOW FUCKS A LITTLE BROTHER OF HIS, WOULD IT BE RIGHT THEN? I MEAN WHERE DO WE DRAW THE LINE? BECAUSE IT IS HIS BROTHER WE SHOULD SAY OKAY THINGS ARE FINE AS LONG AS YOU DON’T DO IT AGAIN?
ReplyDeleteI THOUGHT I WAS GONNA ADD SOMETHING TO THIS TOPIC TODAY, BUT KISH BEAT ME TO IT. I TOTALLY SUPPORT & AGREE WITH KISH'S VIEW OF THE SITUATION, AND I'M DISAPPOINTED THAT HE WAS TAKEN TO TASK ON THIS ONE. RIGHT IS RIGHT AND WRONG IS WRONG.
ReplyDeleteTG-K: I see your point. But our point was that you shouldn't be that harsh to the young man. In many countries - hell, even in the USA - being gay is *wrong*, and we're being judged everyday because of it. Does it make right or wrong then? It's OK in our mind to be gay, but the rest of the country would disagree.
ReplyDeleteYou and I had a convo about my past. I was young, homeless, working the streets. I had sex with older men. Was it right? By many people's definition, hell no. By law, no. Do *I* feel it was wrong? No. Do I regret it? Not at all. To me, it was part of life. And it takes a LOT to share that sort of stuff. You didn't smack me down when I was talking to you... so why did you to this young man?
DUSTY BOOTS - WE TALKED ABOUT THINGS YOU DID WITH STRANGERS NOT A BROTHER & I AM SORRY THAT YOU FELT THAT I WAS HARSH BUT I DON'T AGREE WITH YOU...PLEASE STOP TRYING TO TIE HOMOSEXUALITY IN WITH OTHER THINGS THAT SOCIETY DEEM WRONG...IT IS CRAZY THAT WE SIT AND THINK THAT SOMEONE WHO IS GAY CAN'T SAY SOMETHING NEGATIVE ABOUT SOMEONE WHO IS GAY...THIS IS KINDA CRAZY...
ReplyDeleteI guess we shall agree to disagree then.
ReplyDeleteDUSTY BOOT - I CAN DO THAT NO PROBLEM @ ALL
ReplyDelete"THERE IS NO NEED TO TELL ME THAT YOU STILL LOVE ME BECAUSE I AM NOT THIN SKINNED"
ReplyDeleteThe question is, do you still luv us...? ;)
KA-OS - IF YOU'VE BEEN READING MY BLOG THEN YOU KNOW THE ANSWER TO THAT QUESTION...
ReplyDeleteI LOVE HOW WE WHEN CERTAIN OPINIONS ARE EXPRESSED THAT WE DO NOT AGREE WE LABEL IT JUDGEMENT!!!!!!!!!!!! WHERE SHOULD THE LINES BE DRAWN.... A MAN AND HIS DAUGHTER A WOMAN AND HER SON. HOW MANY OF YOU FEEL AS IF THAT'S WRONG AND IT SHOULDN'T HAPPEN? WHO ARE WE TO JUDGE THEM EH?
ReplyDeleteIF I AM TO USE THE ARGUMENT THAT SO MANY OF YOU ARE PUTTING FORWARD....... ANYWAYS WE ARE ALL ENTITLED TO OUR OPINION AND WHY MUST I BE LABELLED JUDGEMENTAL FOR SHARING A DIFFERENT VIEW.... LET'S NOT BE HYPOCRITES!!!!!!!!!!!!
SO U WANT TO SCREW YOUR SISTER,BROTHER,FATHER ,MOTHER OR WHATEVER,AND FEEL OK WITH IT ,THEN THAT'S U,UR ENTITLED TO YOUR OPINION AND SO AM I.
ReplyDeleteGee Ossie, how can I deny such a carefully articulated point. I mean, with all the exclamation marks, txt spelling, capitals, hyperbole and all. I guess you must be right.
ReplyDeleteka-os, I applaud your attempt at sarcasm.... You are a very skilled user of literary devices.
ReplyDeleteI have spent the last 30 minutes reading and re-reading this post and the comments that have been left. And can i just say that im more shocked about the comments that have been left than wat is in the entry itself. Brothers messing around ok its hella taboo. It's nothing that i personally feel should go on but i know that it does and this proves it. Thinking and doing something are 2 totally different things. Sexual desires are just that desires. But everything we desire isnt good for us to experience. At 17 or 18 years old we know who the hell we are and we know what is right and wrong...thats not experimenting anymore....its just a down and out deed that ur fully aware of. Hell i would have told him, probably even more harshly than TG_K did. "Thats some nasty shyt and yall need counseling" But see the mistake that most of you people keep making is that TG_K has some type of responsibility to always understanding to the things that people decided to share with him. It's not. He is human just like the rest of us and his is entitled to his own opinions. Yes he's someone that puts himself out there and we all feel like we can share things with him but its not his purpose to condone everything that we may do and say. And we all, myself included, need to stop looking at him as someone who should be above it all. He doesn't get paid for this...He does not have restrictions on how he feels and voicing his opinion just because we feel he shouldn't. Nothing about this entry was judgemental on his party. Taking responsibility for our thoughts and actions is all that Thegayte_Keeper is trying to get all of us to see.
ReplyDeleteI just want to know where our moral compass is pointing us with all of this. I am certain that this may sound cliche but let's think about it... Can we live in a world where there is nothing that is out of bounds?
ReplyDeleteHere is my view - we as a community are in a struggle that we have been and will continue to be in and part of that struggle is to dispel the commonly held belief that we are inherently immoral and I'm sorry but it's acts like this that give fuel to the bigotry that we have to fight on a daily basis and what's worse is when we feel that there is nothing wrong with it. I'm not calling for someone to be lynched but let's get real here; where do we actually place the limit? Why do we like to find an excuse for certain behavior? Is it unacceptable to condemn a certain behavior if it demeans us as a whole? [speaking of us] and outside of that what is the lesson to be learned here that life is for pleasure and we should try and get it within every and any avenue? Even Epicurus' teachings held that there should be some restraints in a life that is lived for pleasure.
I just feel we need to be a bit more responsible - experimentation is natural but come on there is a point when we are aware of what our limits are especially at a certain age and I am not condemning the man the deed has been done but it's shocking and baffling and you really shouldn't so easily wrap your mind around it. And believe me none of us are perfect we do fuck up and a fuck up is just that we can talk about it but let's not call it anything else but a fuck up
Gayte,
ReplyDeleteI just want to clearify the point that myself and a few others are trying to make.
Yes, the boy having sex with his brother is wrong, I would say that is the general aggreement.
You have the right to express that opinion to him. However out of mere respect of his humanity there was another way to convey your beliefs to him.
Try these other examples:
Someone getting a DUI. We know it's wrong to drink and drive but there are still some people who do it - regularly unfortunately.
Same with those people who have unprotected sex with strangers in random encounters. We all know the potential consequences of such actions/behaviors but again there are those who do it, fanatically.
I'm not a supporter of these choices, I know them to be wrong. However as a fellow human being I shouldn't take a position of superiority and force a person who does make those choices to feel inferior or guilty for doing so.
That said, Gayte, I owe YOU an apology. Although it came from a place of compassion & empathy for this guy with whom you had this confersation, I kind of became a little judgemental towards you about how you handled it. I think compassion and love are essential factors to better interactions between us as a society. And my personal belief that I would have like to have seen more compassion in your tone with this kid made me less compassionate with you as I should have been.
Truth of the matter is WE ALL are being as judgemental of you as we complain and protest that you were with this kid. For my part of that I'm sorry.
Yes we have a responsiblity to ourselves, family, friends, and society to do what we can to uphold a moral standard, but who are we to measure those around us and the community at large by those standards but not hold ourselves accountable to them as well. (Otherwise aren't we just the pot calling the kettle black?)
Whew! Too much!
ReplyDeleteLMFAO@ACOUSTIC SOUL. Damn where the hell was i when this was written! I'm just catching up so excuse me. Haha. I have read EVERY LAST COMMENT ON HERE and man let me tell you some very interesting thoughts.
ReplyDeleteI laugh..maybe I shouldnt but I do. Right and Wrong...Wrong and Right..we go through those words all our life and tell others what is wrong and what is right. UNLESS U SUCK YOUR BROTHERS DICK or experimented with a family member, U DONT understand how that boy feels or continue to feels. HOW EASY IS IT TO SAY IT WAS RIGHT OR WRONG? VERY. How hard is it to say it is APART OF LIFE AND ADMIT IT...VERY.
THATS WHY IM LAUGHING..IM NOT FROWNING IM NOT SHAKING MY HEAD IM NOT FEELING PERPLEXED OR AMAZED I AM LAUGHING..BECAUSE I KNOW this brotha IS HUMAN figuring his way through things like the rest of us. I'm not passing judgement on TGK. I don't agree what what he said but thats my business. NOTHING SHOCKS ME ANYMORE AND I COMMEND THE BOY FOR HIS HONESTY. Thats my Two cents.